they already have the audio, so it's a matter of reversing the timing of audio and us inputting answer - we usually get audio after we answer, so why not before and make the audio the question?
numbering the tone still bugs me - i'm so busy remembering the number and not the actual pronunciation. i don't get their logic - they say it's for those who don't have the character keyboards, but the french course also deals with accents and their solution was to have a menu bar of accents to choose from, like the numbers we can click on - so what gives? why can't we learn the tones as they are and not confuse the issue more?
"they already have the audio, so it's a matter of reversing the timing of audio and us inputting answer - we usually get audio after we answer, so why not before and make the audio the question?"
This would probably work best with a MC type question because there is literally no way you could absolutely know the answer just by hearing the audio (unless it's a phrase or sentence). Ex - 士 (scholar, shi4), 是 (to be, shi4), 氏 (clan, shi4), 事 (business, shi4).
BTW - Memrise - a MC style test like this should be relatively easy to implement.
@jenniferhunter - sentences would be awesome - short pithy ones like cheng yu that the chinese seem to specialise in, but at this stage i'd settle for the mouse is on the chair.
you bring up an excellent point re multiple meanings - could this be addressed with putting in the grammar and/or allowing multiple answers for the first time it comes up and then the second time, there's one less choice and so on?
@Vino - the mc style test would probably be the easiest to implement right now. You hear the sound, and then you select the character from a group of 4 or 8. Grammer might not help because the way I see it, two characters could have the same part of speech (clan 氏/market 市). At some point - we would get too many "hints/clues" as to make the testing inconsequential.
As for sentences/chengyu - we (Memrise users) need to upload more audio. Than it would become feasible to devise tests around combinations of words/characters. This would be an awesome feature, but it's not practical until we have the necessary resources.
@jenniferhunter - the multiple meaning is already an issue - jiao4 and jue2 are the same word and yet we 'manage' - recently there's been this new message "looking for the pin yin" which gives you another go at the word.
i agree that the mc style test sounds easiest to implement, but i'm here to learn and typing it out would reinforce the learning; if only they would allow accents in the mandarin course. btw, are any of this actually in the works or are we just shooting the breeze here? and why do they allow accents in the french course but not the mandarin course?
@vino - I'm sorry but I'm not understanding. If I heard a word (say 水, water, shui3), I would easily be able to type it. The only problem comes when I hit tone sandhi which would occur only with phrases and sentences. At that point, I don't know how Memrise would deal with the timer issue because not everyone types 100 wpm or greater. I would also require a "typo" button because it would be easier to make mistakes when typing a sentence than entering the pinyin for a single character.
I guess, if the system played an audio and I had to type in a definition, that would be a different matter. Is that what you are envisioning? BTW - it would be awesome but scary if memrise let users try to "draw" the characters for these types of tests.
Regarding accents - this has been much debated. Originally, I learned with the accents so it was a bit of a shock typing out the answer according to the Memrise system. Now, I find this method very easy. I only wish they would allow for pinyin grouping for words and phrases - like bathroom or shanghai - instead of separating each character's individual pinyin.
@jenniferhunter - yes - hear audio instead of see word. all i meant was whether written or heard there is overlap - some words share characters, others, the same pronounciation.
regarding the numbering, it's weird because i'm remembering the number and not the tone, unless it's the fourth tone, otherwise, i'm just not picking up the tones - i remember them but when i hear the audio, it really could be anyone of 1,2 or 3 as far as I'm concerned. this is why i want a listening test.
@Big_Kahuna that sucks - upon reading Vino's post I thought about the tone game also, then I read your post. I wonder what happened because that really does help.
@Vino - here's a suggestion - I would create 3 courses. A course that has just 1st tones. Another that has only 2nd tones. And another that has only 3rd tones. Make sure the words chosen have audio samples. Then, I would just practice those courses. I'm thinking that the sheer repetition might help register/link up the sound of the tone with the tone number.
@jenniferhunter : good idea....was thinking i should just keep hitting the audio button but this could be better.
btw where is tone game? tried it once but was only 10 words in and none of them seemed to come up, so gave up. Now however.....why did it disappear?