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Turbo-charging the Korean content

The conventions from the other thread (http://www.memrise.com/topic/K... ) seem good to me, but I would add that adjectives shouldn't be included as they are formed from verbs and if they were included some beginners might do the mistake of using adjective + 이에요 in real world situations instead of the proper form.

The conventions from the other thread (http://www.memrise.com/topic/K... ) seem good to me, but I would add that adjectives shouldn't be included as they are formed from verbs and if they were included some beginners might do the mistake of using adjective + 이에요 in real world situations instead of the proper form.

That's a really good point, but what do you mean when you say that they should not be included?

That's a really good point, but what do you mean when you say that they should not be included?

Here's a problem that I'm wondering about: differentiating between passive voice and adjectives. for example, 닫히다 would mean "to be closed (by someone)" such as an English sentence along the lines of "The door was closed by the wind" (바람에 문이 닫혔어요), but with the current rules, it would just be written as "to be closed". This would give someone who is not familiar with the active/passive voice rules to mistakenly think that the word is an adjective, which it is not.I hope there is a way that is easy to understand both for the person generating the content, but more importantly, the person who is using the content. How would you guys write a word like that?

Here's a problem that I'm wondering about: differentiating between passive voice and adjectives. for example, 닫히다 would mean "to be closed (by someone)" such as an English sentence along the lines of "The door was closed by the wind" (바람에 문이 닫혔어요), but with the current rules, it would just be written as "to be closed". This would give someone who is not familiar with the active/passive voice rules to mistakenly think that the word is an adjective, which it is not.I hope there is a way that is easy to understand both for the person generating the content, but more importantly, the person who is using the content. How would you guys write a word like that?

I meant that adjectives should be listed in their dictionary verb form instead of the -ㄴ, -은, -는 form.

I meant that adjectives should be listed in their dictionary verb form instead of the -ㄴ, -은, -는 form.

Oh, I see where you're going with that. If you ever see any adjectives listed in noun modifying form, let me know and I can change them back to dictionary form- you're absolutely right that they shouldn't be that way and I can only guess that someone went through and changed them (back when that was possible).My skype is rickcarlino, feel free to message me whenever you find something like that (or to just talk about Korean or memrise in general). I noticed you are putting a lot of sino-korean etymologies up on your memstream- are you a Korean studies guy also?

Oh, I see where you're going with that. If you ever see any adjectives listed in noun modifying form, let me know and I can change them back to dictionary form- you're absolutely right that they shouldn't be that way and I can only guess that someone went through and changed them (back when that was possible).My skype is rickcarlino, feel free to message me whenever you find something like that (or to just talk about Korean or memrise in general). I noticed you are putting a lot of sino-korean etymologies up on your memstream- are you a Korean studies guy also?

No I'm not studying korean, korean and korea is just something i'm very interested on learning about after going to korea 2 times I'm trying to improve my korean a bit ;)

No I'm not studying korean, korean and korea is just something i'm very interested on learning about after going to korea 2 times I'm trying to improve my korean a bit ;)

Hi everybody~ I'm willing to help you guys with anything! I'm a Korean-American who speaks a kind of mix of Korean and English at home. I'm not completely fluent but I do think I'm not a beginner, at least! And if there are any Korean-related problems that you or I can't handle, I can just relay them to my native Korean speaking family~

Hi everybody~ I'm willing to help you guys with anything! I'm a Korean-American who speaks a kind of mix of Korean and English at home. I'm not completely fluent but I do think I'm not a beginner, at least! And if there are any Korean-related problems that you or I can't handle, I can just relay them to my native Korean speaking family~

Great, good to meet you afusian!. I have added you as a "topic curator" which is the terminology we are now using. There are a two or three more people who have written in to me about helping with this who will hopefully introduce themselves here soon.RickC / TL-izolight could you write up the correct phrasing that you would like to see on the conventions and I will make the change on the FAQ. Rick, do you have a list that you are working from for the master list? Would it be possible to create a series of sets of 50 words with just the Korean word and then "not yet checked" as the definition.Then if anyone felt that they wanted to get do some creation work, they could go to one of these wordlists, download the spreadsheet and start filling in the definition and other required fields.When they have finished adding them, they could upload the spreadsheet back to the wordlist. This would create new items in the database. Once the set was in this state, they could then post to this forum saying that the set was ready for moderation, and another user could then head over and moderate it. The moderation would involve a) downloading a spreadsheet and checking that everything was in order. b) merging the old item and the new ones, throwing out the old definition. I can take you all through this process - it is going to be made available for you very shortly.Then once the words are all moderated, we can go through and record audio for all of them - afusian it would be great to have your help here! Then they can be added in to the Master set, or any other wordsets. How does that soundIf it sounds good, RickC could you create a couple of test sets so that we can give it a try. Key things to think about:is 50 a good number? too many to be easily do-able? or too few to be really making progress? or just right? What are the slow points and how could we make them faster?Very excited about this!

Great, good to meet you afusian!. I have added you as a "topic curator" which is the terminology we are now using. There are a two or three more people who have written in to me about helping with this who will hopefully introduce themselves here soon.RickC / TL-izolight could you write up the correct phrasing that you would like to see on the conventions and I will make the change on the FAQ. Rick, do you have a list that you are working from for the master list? Would it be possible to create a series of sets of 50 words with just the Korean word and then "not yet checked" as the definition.Then if anyone felt that they wanted to get do some creation work, they could go to one of these wordlists, download the spreadsheet and start filling in the definition and other required fields.When they have finished adding them, they could upload the spreadsheet back to the wordlist. This would create new items in the database. Once the set was in this state, they could then post to this forum saying that the set was ready for moderation, and another user could then head over and moderate it. The moderation would involve a) downloading a spreadsheet and checking that everything was in order. b) merging the old item and the new ones, throwing out the old definition. I can take you all through this process - it is going to be made available for you very shortly.Then once the words are all moderated, we can go through and record audio for all of them - afusian it would be great to have your help here! Then they can be added in to the Master set, or any other wordsets. How does that soundIf it sounds good, RickC could you create a couple of test sets so that we can give it a try. Key things to think about:is 50 a good number? too many to be easily do-able? or too few to be really making progress? or just right? What are the slow points and how could we make them faster?Very excited about this!

We could put this in the "part of speech" field (soon to be made visible) as "passive verb". That should do it, no?

We could put this in the "part of speech" field (soon to be made visible) as "passive verb". That should do it, no?

Hi Ben,This sounds like a good idea. The volunteers and I have been using a GoogleDocs spreadsheet at the moment. I'll send you an invitation.

Hi Ben,This sounds like a good idea. The volunteers and I have been using a GoogleDocs spreadsheet at the moment. I'll send you an invitation.

Another thing I've been thinking about is how we should handle 한자, the chinese characters, should they just be put in as an etymology mem or should we create seperate wordlists that are 한자-english and the 한글 as the pronounciation part?

Another thing I've been thinking about is how we should handle 한자, the chinese characters, should they just be put in as an etymology mem or should we create seperate wordlists that are 한자-english and the 한글 as the pronounciation part?

I like the 한자-english meaning-한글 pronunciation idea, definitely.

I like the 한자-english meaning-한글 pronunciation idea, definitely.

I don't have a great sense of what is involved here, but if we can fit this onto the same items, it would be better: if we start creating new lists with different information int the fields, then we will need to put them in a new "topic". This is to avoid them getting muddled up in multiple choice tests. And also if you learned a word in one topic then you would have to learn it again in the other topic. So is there a way around this? We have created a second topic for Japanese, for the Kanji and it does work ok, but it is really essential to learn the Kanji separately there. Is that the case for Korean? Do we need a Korean Kanji set?

I don't have a great sense of what is involved here, but if we can fit this onto the same items, it would be better: if we start creating new lists with different information int the fields, then we will need to put them in a new "topic". This is to avoid them getting muddled up in multiple choice tests. And also if you learned a word in one topic then you would have to learn it again in the other topic. So is there a way around this? We have created a second topic for Japanese, for the Kanji and it does work ok, but it is really essential to learn the Kanji separately there. Is that the case for Korean? Do we need a Korean Kanji set?

I think someone actually already did create such a language set a while back (this was before the site re-make a few days ago, I'm not sure if it still exists publicly). If there was a "Korean Hanja" set, I think it would perform the task just fine as most people learn the characters separately from their usual words. What I mean to say is that I have never seen any type of text book that teaches more than one character at a time. Usually, they pick one "building block" morpheme and then after teaching it, show some multi-character example words.As far as special fields go, it may be needed. When one learns hanja, there are four points per character that one must learn. I'll give an example with the the character for water:1. Character: 水2. Pronunciation of the character: 수 ("soo"- the way it is pronounced when used as a morpheme in Chinese-based words, similar to "shui" in modern mandarin)3. Native korean pronounciation: 물 ("mool"- the actual Korean word that is represented by items 1 and 2)4. The english meaning: waterAll four of these are important, and I feel like its a hassle to have a "Character to Korean" and then a "Character to English" set. It would be great if there was a more seamless approach.I'm somewhat conflicted on which order to quiz them in, though.Perhaps:1-->2,3,43-->1,2,44-->1,2,3(using the example above)BUT, under no circumstance should item 2 be quizzed to any other meaning.I think here are too many different meanings for one pronounciation (for instance, this "soo" means water, but it could just as easily mean "Hand", "Number" or "Tree").If Memrise quizzed all 4 components in that manner, I feel that I would have a very, very firm grasp on Sinokorean characters.Sorry if this description comes off as a bit unintelligible. If I'm being too vague, please let me know.

I think someone actually already did create such a language set a while back (this was before the site re-make a few days ago, I'm not sure if it still exists publicly). If there was a "Korean Hanja" set, I think it would perform the task just fine as most people learn the characters separately from their usual words. What I mean to say is that I have never seen any type of text book that teaches more than one character at a time. Usually, they pick one "building block" morpheme and then after teaching it, show some multi-character example words.As far as special fields go, it may be needed. When one learns hanja, there are four points per character that one must learn. I'll give an example with the the character for water:1. Character: 水2. Pronunciation of the character: 수 ("soo"- the way it is pronounced when used as a morpheme in Chinese-based words, similar to "shui" in modern mandarin)3. Native korean pronounciation: 물 ("mool"- the actual Korean word that is represented by items 1 and 2)4. The english meaning: waterAll four of these are important, and I feel like its a hassle to have a "Character to Korean" and then a "Character to English" set. It would be great if there was a more seamless approach.I'm somewhat conflicted on which order to quiz them in, though.Perhaps:1-->2,3,43-->1,2,44-->1,2,3(using the example above)BUT, under no circumstance should item 2 be quizzed to any other meaning.I think here are too many different meanings for one pronounciation (for instance, this "soo" means water, but it could just as easily mean "Hand", "Number" or "Tree").If Memrise quizzed all 4 components in that manner, I feel that I would have a very, very firm grasp on Sinokorean characters.Sorry if this description comes off as a bit unintelligible. If I'm being too vague, please let me know.

All the old topics are still there, don't worry - they are just hidden a bit. We are going to fix that ASAP. So we can have a topic for learning the Hanja. This would work well I think. In the eaxmple that you list above, we could have the "word" as the Chinese Character (水), the Definition as its meaning (water), and then in the "pronunciation" field have "native pronunciation; chinese pronunciation" - ie, in this example, "수; 물" This would mean that you were tested first on the meaning, and then later on the pronunciation. You would have to type the pronunciation in Korean script, and could write either or both of the pronunciations.The only issue here would be if there are sometimes multiple pronunciations of a character. Are there? this might make the display a bit cluttered. What do you think?

All the old topics are still there, don't worry - they are just hidden a bit. We are going to fix that ASAP. So we can have a topic for learning the Hanja. This would work well I think. In the eaxmple that you list above, we could have the "word" as the Chinese Character (水), the Definition as its meaning (water), and then in the "pronunciation" field have "native pronunciation; chinese pronunciation" - ie, in this example, "수; 물" This would mean that you were tested first on the meaning, and then later on the pronunciation. You would have to type the pronunciation in Korean script, and could write either or both of the pronunciations.The only issue here would be if there are sometimes multiple pronunciations of a character. Are there? this might make the display a bit cluttered. What do you think?

Hi!I study Korean and I am a native Bulgarian speaker. Right now I have time to help so please let me know how I can be useful. My Korean language level is intermediate (TOPIK - 4th level).

Hi!I study Korean and I am a native Bulgarian speaker. Right now I have time to help so please let me know how I can be useful. My Korean language level is intermediate (TOPIK - 4th level).

I've uploaded a list with about 450 words to the hanja topichttp://www.memrise.com/set/100... Is there any way to already add dependencies in the spreadsheet as I also want to add the single characters and have this list depend on them.

I've uploaded a list with about 450 words to the hanja topichttp://www.memrise.com/set/100... Is there any way to already add dependencies in the spreadsheet as I also want to add the single characters and have this list depend on them.

I added a Hanja wordlist athttp://www.memrise.com/topic/k... Would it be possible to add dependencies in the spreadsheet to be uploaded as I plan on making a single character list and have the word from this one depend on them.

I added a Hanja wordlist athttp://www.memrise.com/topic/k... Would it be possible to add dependencies in the spreadsheet to be uploaded as I plan on making a single character list and have the word from this one depend on them.

That's great news. Please contact me via skype- "rickcarlino"

That's great news. Please contact me via skype- "rickcarlino"

I have added a list with about 450 words to the Hanja sectionhttp://www.memrise.com/... A list with single characters will follow later.Is there a way to add dependencies in the spreadsheet?

I have added a list with about 450 words to the Hanja sectionhttp://www.memrise.com/... A list with single characters will follow later.Is there a way to add dependencies in the spreadsheet?

Yes, I think it's important to make some elements of Korean grammar salient or at least visible to learners. There isn't much in the way of formal Korean language education in most western countries. I'd guess that the average Korean learner probably falls into two camps: Those living/working in Korea or with Koreans, and those interested in Korean culture (eSports TL users, K-pop shudder, martial arts, etc.). For better or for worse, I imagine that a majority will be picking up grammar on the fly.It'd be nice to be able to at least see the basic conjugations of verbs when a user views their garden. I know I've struggled some when attempting to flex my new vocabulary by making mistakes attempting to 'guess' a verb conjugation.Additionally, when testing word recognition via multiple choice, it's probably best to not mix nouns and verbs. If a word ends in 다 but only one of the multiple choice answers is a verb, then a user can pick the correct choice even with no association of the word whatsoever. I know I've been able to do this as I learn new words and it's made me a bit lazy when learning new vocabulary.고맙습니다!

Yes, I think it's important to make some elements of Korean grammar salient or at least visible to learners. There isn't much in the way of formal Korean language education in most western countries. I'd guess that the average Korean learner probably falls into two camps: Those living/working in Korea or with Koreans, and those interested in Korean culture (eSports TL users, K-pop shudder, martial arts, etc.). For better or for worse, I imagine that a majority will be picking up grammar on the fly.It'd be nice to be able to at least see the basic conjugations of verbs when a user views their garden. I know I've struggled some when attempting to flex my new vocabulary by making mistakes attempting to 'guess' a verb conjugation.Additionally, when testing word recognition via multiple choice, it's probably best to not mix nouns and verbs. If a word ends in 다 but only one of the multiple choice answers is a verb, then a user can pick the correct choice even with no association of the word whatsoever. I know I've been able to do this as I learn new words and it's made me a bit lazy when learning new vocabulary.고맙습니다!

Hi,It's good to see some great ideas you have suggested for the Korean content. I would like to be involved as a korean volunteer too, to improve the korean content in memrise. Ah!, I just hope that one day Memrise will also feature Korean language as Featured Languages in it's homepage. _ _ There are some amazing people here like Rick Carlino,Onemillionlove who are working hard to improve the korean content. I would like to join them too~~ _ _

Hi,It's good to see some great ideas you have suggested for the Korean content. I would like to be involved as a korean volunteer too, to improve the korean content in memrise. Ah!, I just hope that one day Memrise will also feature Korean language as Featured Languages in it's homepage. _ _ There are some amazing people here like Rick Carlino,Onemillionlove who are working hard to improve the korean content. I would like to join them too~~ _ _

Great to hear! Contact me via skype- "rickcarlino".

Great to hear! Contact me via skype- "rickcarlino".

Hey everyone. New to Memrise and enjoying it. Wondering how I can help. Would be happy putting definitions to words if that is still going on. Is it possible to send PM's on Memrise?

Hey everyone. New to Memrise and enjoying it. Wondering how I can help. Would be happy putting definitions to words if that is still going on. Is it possible to send PM's on Memrise?

I think that there is always more to do with content creation! Words and definitions are one place, recording audio, adding sample sentences, mems etc... lets see what the other Korean curators suggest as being the next focus. At the moment you can't send PMs on Memrise, but that is going to change very soon!Best wishesBen

I think that there is always more to do with content creation! Words and definitions are one place, recording audio, adding sample sentences, mems etc... lets see what the other Korean curators suggest as being the next focus. At the moment you can't send PMs on Memrise, but that is going to change very soon!Best wishesBen

Greetings! Feel free to contact me via skype (rickcarlino) for the time being until PM's get implemented. There is plenty to do, and, unfortunately, I've been too busy studying Korean at my university this semester to add new content like I had been in the past, but there are some things we have been working on. Thanks for your interest, hope to talk to you soon.

Greetings! Feel free to contact me via skype (rickcarlino) for the time being until PM's get implemented. There is plenty to do, and, unfortunately, I've been too busy studying Korean at my university this semester to add new content like I had been in the past, but there are some things we have been working on. Thanks for your interest, hope to talk to you soon.

안녕하세요 Rick, About a year ago I contacted you about helping to input new vocabulary/work on 한자/etymology, etc but then ended up busier than expected in a land of extremely poor internet access.

Having just found my way back (맴라이스 사랑해!), I'd love to be able to contribute, so please just let me know how I could be of assistance. I'm an intermediate speaker, living and working in Korea, and mostly focusing on vocabulary/한자/more complicated grammatical expressions these days.

Looking forward to working with you all! I'm really impressed with the progress memrise has made since I was last on here.

Thanks for all your continued work improving the Korean content!

Hi Claire, it's good to see that you're back at it. These days I have been so busy that I haven't even had time to water the plants, let alone contribute new material, But there are a ton of new features coming out soon like the "patrol" feature which will allow users to validate the correctness of items in the dictionary, example sentences, etc.

Aside from that, creating new content is always helpful, especially with how they share/merge duplicate dictionary items now. Basically, if you upload content, the definition gets shared with all users who upload that word in the future. It's a much better way of doing things, as long as the community stay on top of weeding out bad items.

Best of luck on your studies!